Comments on: H.R. 4411: Unlawful Internet Gambling and Enforcement Act (UIGEA) http://www.midasoracle.org/2006/10/04/hr-4411-internet-gambling-prohibition-and-enforcement-act/ Prediction Markets For All Tue, 06 Jan 2009 10:55:56 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.7 hourly 1 By: Jason Ruspini http://www.midasoracle.org/2006/10/04/hr-4411-internet-gambling-prohibition-and-enforcement-act/#comment-18 Jason Ruspini Thu, 05 Oct 2006 14:11:37 +0000 http://www.midasoracle.org/2006/10/04/hr-4411-internet-gambling-prohibition-and-enforcement-act/#comment-18 I don't think you are contradicting me, Chris. I didn't say they couldn't <i>attempt</i> extradition. And I appreciate the continued "bacio della morte" of that nickname. I don’t think you are contradicting me, Chris. I didn’t say they couldn’t attempt extradition. And I appreciate the continued “bacio della morte” of that nickname.

]]> By: Crosbie Fitch http://www.midasoracle.org/2006/10/04/hr-4411-internet-gambling-prohibition-and-enforcement-act/#comment-15 Crosbie Fitch Thu, 05 Oct 2006 10:00:16 +0000 http://www.midasoracle.org/2006/10/04/hr-4411-internet-gambling-prohibition-and-enforcement-act/#comment-15 If US citizens can buy shares in UK companies... UK company Shergar Holdings makes an executive decision to invest all share capital in a prediction that Shergar will win the Grand National. They decide to wind up the company after the race. Investors' shares have either gone up or down in value... Legal in the UK? Illegal in the US? Must all UK companies with US investors now avoid all use of anything remotely resembling gambling? If US citizens can buy shares in UK companies…

UK company Shergar Holdings makes an executive decision to invest all share capital in a prediction that Shergar will win the Grand National.

They decide to wind up the company after the race. Investors’ shares have either gone up or down in value…

Legal in the UK?

Illegal in the US?

Must all UK companies with US investors now avoid all use of anything remotely resembling gambling?

]]> By: Chris Masse http://www.midasoracle.org/2006/10/04/hr-4411-internet-gambling-prohibition-and-enforcement-act/#comment-13 Chris Masse Wed, 04 Oct 2006 20:47:41 +0000 http://www.midasoracle.org/2006/10/04/hr-4411-internet-gambling-prohibition-and-enforcement-act/#comment-13 “I wonder if the US extradition treaty with the UK renders UK based online wagering providers subject to extradition?” Sorry to contradict Jason "The Brain" Ruspini, but the answer is yes. After 9/11, the USA and the UK have signed a new extradition treaty, tougher. British businessmen have been extradited under this new treaty. For more info, dig for the BetOnSports and SportingBet arrests: http://www.chrisfmasse.com/3/3/news/2006/09/ http://www.chrisfmasse.com/3/3/news/2006/08/ http://www.chrisfmasse.com/3/3/news/2006/07/ As for the taxes, the offshore, Web-based sportsbooks or betting exchanges do not pay the US wagering taxes. They could be charged for that, also. --- Internet gambling ban has passed. http://www.midasoracle.org/2006/09/30/internet-gambling-ban-has-passed/ Neteller will comply with the Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act of 2006. http://www.midasoracle.org/2006/10/19/neteller-will-comply-with-the-unlawful-internet-gambling-enforcement-act-of-2006/ Reality check on TradeSports-InTrade’s recent statement http://www.midasoracle.org/2006/10/25/reality-check-on-tradesports-intrades-recent-statement/ TEN CEO John Delaney finally admits that the new law will cut off TradeSports-InTrade’s revenues. http://www.midasoracle.org/2006/11/05/ten-ceo-john-delaney-finally-admits-that-the-new-law-will-cut-off-tradesports-intrades-revenues/ Internet Gambling Crisis - AGAIN http://www.midasoracle.org/2007/01/16/internet-gambling-crisis-again/ Using NETeller for TradeSports-InTrade, no more http://www.midasoracle.org/2007/01/18/using-neteller-for-tradesports-intrade-no-more/ TradeSports-InTrade John Delaney won’t travel to the U.S. anymore. http://www.midasoracle.org/2007/01/19/tradesports-intrade-john-delaney-wont-travel-to-the-us-anymore/ Criminal prosecutions related to online gambling will be pursued even in cases where assets and defendants are positioned outside of the United States. http://www.midasoracle.org/2007/02/03/criminal-prosecutions-related-to-online-gambling-will-be-pursued-even-in-cases-where-assets-and-defendants-are-positioned-outside-of-the-united-states/ TRADESPORTS-INTRADE HAS REMOVED NETELLER AS A DEPOSIT AND WITHDRAWAL METHOD FOR ALL MEMBERS –NOT JUST THE US CITIZENS AND RESIDENTS. http://www.midasoracle.org/2007/02/05/tradesports-intrade-has-removed-neteller-as-a-deposit-and-withdrawal-method-for-all-members-not-just-the-us-citizens-and-residents/ NETELLER RECORDS OF THE TRADESPORTS-INTRADE CLIENTS WHO ARE US CITIZENS/RESIDENTS ARE NOW IN THE HANDS OF THE US DOJ AND IRS. http://www.midasoracle.org/2007/02/09/neteller-records-of-the-tradesports-intrade-clients-who-are-us-citizensresidents-are-now-in-the-hands-of-the-us-doj-and-irs/ NETeller money seized by U.S. prosecutors will be returned to NETeller’s (now, former) U.S. customers. http://www.midasoracle.org/2007/03/21/neteller-money-seized-by-us-prosecutors-will-be-returned-to-netellers-now-former-us-customers/ Will InTrade-TradeSpots lose big after the (hypothetical) passing of the 2007 Internet Gambling Regulation and Enforcement Act??? http://www.midasoracle.org/2007/05/03/will-intrade-tradespots-lose-big-after-the-hypothetical-passing-of-the-2007-internet-gambling-regulation-and-enforcement-act/ US DOJ searches financial records for traces of Internet gambling and betting. http://www.midasoracle.org/2007/05/12/us-doj-searches-financial-records-for-traces-of-internet-gambling-and-betting/ “I wonder if the US extradition treaty with the UK renders UK based online wagering providers subject to extradition?”

Sorry to contradict Jason “The Brain” Ruspini, but the answer is yes. After 9/11, the USA and the UK have signed a new extradition treaty, tougher. British businessmen have been extradited under this new treaty.

For more info, dig for the BetOnSports and SportingBet arrests:
http://www.chrisfmasse.com/3/3/news/2006/09/
http://www.chrisfmasse.com/3/3/news/2006/08/
http://www.chrisfmasse.com/3/3/news/2006/07/

As for the taxes, the offshore, Web-based sportsbooks or betting exchanges do not pay the US wagering taxes. They could be charged for that, also.

—

Internet gambling ban has passed.
http://www.midasoracle.org/200.....as-passed/

Neteller will comply with the Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act of 2006.
http://www.midasoracle.org/200.....t-of-2006/

Reality check on TradeSports-InTrade’s recent statement
http://www.midasoracle.org/200.....statement/

TEN CEO John Delaney finally admits that the new law will cut off TradeSports-InTrade’s revenues.
http://www.midasoracle.org/200.....-revenues/

Internet Gambling Crisis - AGAIN
http://www.midasoracle.org/200.....sis-again/

Using NETeller for TradeSports-InTrade, no more
http://www.midasoracle.org/200.....e-no-more/

TradeSports-InTrade John Delaney won’t travel to the U.S. anymore.
http://www.midasoracle.org/200.....s-anymore/

Criminal prosecutions related to online gambling will be pursued even in cases where assets and defendants are positioned outside of the United States.
http://www.midasoracle.org/200.....ed-states/

TRADESPORTS-INTRADE HAS REMOVED NETELLER AS A DEPOSIT AND WITHDRAWAL METHOD FOR ALL MEMBERS –NOT JUST THE US CITIZENS AND RESIDENTS.
http://www.midasoracle.org/200.....residents/

NETELLER RECORDS OF THE TRADESPORTS-INTRADE CLIENTS WHO ARE US CITIZENS/RESIDENTS ARE NOW IN THE HANDS OF THE US DOJ AND IRS.
http://www.midasoracle.org/200.....j-and-irs/

NETeller money seized by U.S. prosecutors will be returned to NETeller’s (now, former) U.S. customers.
http://www.midasoracle.org/200.....customers/

Will InTrade-TradeSpots lose big after the (hypothetical) passing of the 2007 Internet Gambling Regulation and Enforcement Act???
http://www.midasoracle.org/200.....ement-act/

US DOJ searches financial records for traces of Internet gambling and betting.
http://www.midasoracle.org/200.....d-betting/

]]> By: Jason Ruspini http://www.midasoracle.org/2006/10/04/hr-4411-internet-gambling-prohibition-and-enforcement-act/#comment-12 Jason Ruspini Wed, 04 Oct 2006 19:50:53 +0000 http://www.midasoracle.org/2006/10/04/hr-4411-internet-gambling-prohibition-and-enforcement-act/#comment-12 "I wonder if the US extradition treaty with the UK renders UK based online wagering providers subject to extradition?" Unlikely since no UK law was broken -- gambling laws, that is. In terms of the tax evasion issue: "Some British internet betting companies have previously offered to pay American taxes through a high-profile media campaign, but the US Government has been unwilling to condone lawbreaking. Mr Knowles believes that proof of such an offer might be enough to persuade an English court to refuse extradition. 'It would certainly give rise to an abuse-of-process argument,' he said." http://business.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,8209-2277629,00.html “I wonder if the US extradition treaty with the UK renders UK based online wagering providers subject to extradition?”

Unlikely since no UK law was broken — gambling laws, that is. In terms of the tax evasion issue: “Some British internet betting companies have previously offered to pay American taxes through a high-profile media campaign, but the US Government has been unwilling to condone lawbreaking. Mr Knowles believes that proof of such an offer might be enough to persuade an English court to refuse extradition. ‘It would certainly give rise to an abuse-of-process argument,’ he said.”

http://business.timesonline.co.....29,00.html

]]> By: Crosbie Fitch http://www.midasoracle.org/2006/10/04/hr-4411-internet-gambling-prohibition-and-enforcement-act/#comment-11 Crosbie Fitch Wed, 04 Oct 2006 17:14:06 +0000 http://www.midasoracle.org/2006/10/04/hr-4411-internet-gambling-prohibition-and-enforcement-act/#comment-11 Ah... Thanks. :) Commission is a no-no too... Looks like the US has just decided to opt out of a glorious future in e-commerce. Just as the incredible utility of file-sharing systems can be scuppered by a prohibition of their use given they facilitate copyright infringement, so can general purpose prediction markets be scuppered - because their owners then have to take pains to ensure that no deal can be construed as a bet or wager. Risk is a part of commerce. Risk can appear frivolous and may be exciting, even entertaining, and so prohibiting it online just because it can be seen as a vice for those abusing its indulgence, is probably extremely short-sighted. I wonder if the US extradition treaty with the UK renders UK based online wagering providers subject to extradition? Non-US sites must presumably now base themselves in Tuvalu, Vanuatu, etc. Ah… Thanks. :)

Commission is a no-no too…

Looks like the US has just decided to opt out of a glorious future in e-commerce.

Just as the incredible utility of file-sharing systems can be scuppered by a prohibition of their use given they facilitate copyright infringement, so can general purpose prediction markets be scuppered - because their owners then have to take pains to ensure that no deal can be construed as a bet or wager.

Risk is a part of commerce. Risk can appear frivolous and may be exciting, even entertaining, and so prohibiting it online just because it can be seen as a vice for those abusing its indulgence, is probably extremely short-sighted.

I wonder if the US extradition treaty with the UK renders UK based online wagering providers subject to extradition? Non-US sites must presumably now base themselves in Tuvalu, Vanuatu, etc.

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